"It makes intuitive sense that any wheels manufactured with sharper than average edges at the bead where that wheel's rim makes contact with our tires may very well see faster deterioration of the tire's sidewall at that point of contact. I dont have any experience with Easton rims. It also indicated that other wheel makers are seeing similar problems with the tires. We ship within the USA and International. Is this also true of older gen RH TC tires that have Compass badging? (The current ETRTO standard requires inner sidewalls with a G height of 5.2 6.5 mm.). We mold a chafer strip into the bead that reinforces the area where the tire touches the rim. Good news that youre looking into this, its very difficult and confusing as a consumer to have a good overview of different standards and compatability. This means that the tire fit is much more consistent. Now the official report is in: Our high-performance tires have passed Enves tests with flying colors confirming what weve found ourselves. Models:M525, M630, M635, M640, M685, M730, M735, M735E, M930, AM30. I really enjoyed riding and racing your tires, and it was a shame to give them up but based on the problems I had no choice. 1600 Pearl St., Ste 300Boulder, CO 80302This website copyright 2022. I did not find this particularly satisfying, especially given that my Enve 5.6s on one of my road race bikes uses a hook rim design. I wont mention names, but we got reports of all the big brands having problems. I do agree that this is not a Compass specific problem (Enve has a list of non compatible tires). Saddleback Ltd is registered in England & Wales. Potholes and unforeseen impacts are part of life, but that doesnt mean they need to ruin your ride. Such excessively sharp edges can result from design thus affecting an entire model of wheel, from anomalies in the manufacturing process thus affecting a number of wheels manufactured during a production run, or from a failure to observe a manufacturing defect or damage to a single rim. The problem is that Im too heavy for carbon rims and theres exactly one rim manufacturer that sells hooked aluminum rims with 36h. For additional information or photos, please emailstore@playtri.com or call us at 972-730-3288, *Specifications subject to change without notice from manufacturers. Has Enve changed their hookless rim design between M50s and M525? (Visit our tire pressure page to dial in your best tire pressure). Your ENVE SES wheels may be set up and run with inner-tubes and non-tubeless tyres or tubeless (TL) and tubeless ready (TLR) tyres alike. 2 mm of diameter is only 1 mm of radius, but over 6 mm of circumference. Weve also worked with Zipp to ensure optimum tire/rim compatibility. Or were they concerned that sales might suffer if they raised a concern? The tube reinforces the joint between tire and rim, and the risk of blow-offs is much-reduced. The benefits of road tubeless are as follows: Lower rolling resistance By eliminating the inner-tube, the friction between tire and tube is also eliminated, allowing the tire roll, flex, and conform to the road with greater efficiency. And good fit is what you want for tubeless tires. On its website, Enve said all its rims comply with ETRTO standards, with the exception of its M Series M60 Plus and SES 4.5 AR Disc rims. Aerodynamics are an unalienable right for road cyclists and triathletes that allows for greater efficiency and confidence inspiring handling, regardless of wind conditions. Has anything changed with your TC tires since last year. Also e-bike rims might be suitable for larger riders. The correct diameter is important for both, of course its just that the hooks of an aluminum rim give you an extra layer of safety to make up for the larger manufacturing tolerances. Vittoria also suggested that riders inspect their wheels for any sharp edges that could cause premature tire wear. The only ones I can recall are from the 1970s and early 80s. The G27 features a 27mm internal width that is intended for pairing with tyres 42mm with 55mm/2.0 tyres being the target tyre width for this rim. Since I very much doubt that ENVE have changed their molds, the only possible way your current extralight TC tires could be safe with ENVE hookless rims is if you have changed something with the beads. Like our SES wheel family, the Foundation Collection and its ENVE 45 were tested and developed at the Mercedes Benz Formula One wind-tunnel to deliver best-in-class real world aero performance. Tubeless tires are an emerging technology. https://www.velocityusa.com/product/rim_applications/clydesdale. But how would they perform with our supple high-performance tires? They are formed from extrusions (imagine squeezing frosting out of a pastry bag when icing a cake). We use cookies to give you the best experience on our website. With your new rims and newer-production tires, I am sure you experience would be better. ENVE chooses a hookless tubeless rim profile as it allows the rims critical tolerance at the bead seat diameter to be both consistent and accurate. They are fine with many gravel tires that are derived from mtb tires. Perhaps they didnt get the feedback from the field that there was a problem? I have bought a pair of DT Swiss GRC 1400 Carbon hookless: Any thoughts on how Rene Herse tires would work tubeless with these rims? Rene Herse tires (all casings) are safe to use with Enve rims. (Few cars, motorcycles and mountain bikes exceed 2.5 bar/35 psi.) Enve tested the bead length, bead stiffness, casing stiffness, blow-off pressure and a number of other parameters. Fortunately, here at Rene Herse Cycles, we had a head start on this development: Several of our local riders have been experimenting with tubeless since 2012 before there even were tubeless rims and tires. Youll find a wealth of information below on what tyres to use with which, Teravail Rampart All-Road Durable TR 32mm, Teravail Rampart All-Road Light/Supple TR (Black Sidewall Only) 32mm, Hutchinson Fusion 5 Performance Storm TR 25mm, Specialized S-Works Turbo Rapidair 2Bliss Ready (2020) 26mm, Specialized S-Works Turbo RapidAir 2Bliss Ready (2020) 28mm, Teravail Rampart All-Road Durable TR 28mm, Teravail Rampart All-Road Light/Supple TR 28mm, Hutchinson Fusion 5 All Season Storm TR 25mm, Models:SES 2.2, SES 3.4, SES 5.6, SES 7.8, SES Disc Wheel. Potholes and unforeseen impacts are part of life, but that doesnt mean they need to ruin your ride. In particular, Challenge said that Enve's SES model rims have a sharp hook that can cut sidewalls. Youll find a wealth of information below on what tyres to use with which ENVE wheelsets, as well as general information on ENVE wheels. Like all our rims, the Foundation Collection and its ENVE 45 are handmade and assembled in our Ogden, Utah based, state-of-the-art carbon wheel manufacturing facility. The G27 features a 27mm internal width that is intended for pairing with tyres 42mm with 55mm/2.0 tyres being the target tyre width for this rim.Due to the straight sidewall/hookless design of this rim and inherent high volume design, it is important to understand that not all tyres are created equal and for that reason one should pay special attention to the pressure ratings of both the tyre and the rim.G23 Max pressure for a 32mm tyre = 60psi/4.1barG27 Max pressure for a 42MM tyre = 40psi/2.75bar, Models:M525, M630, M635, M640, M685, M730, M735, M735E, M930, AM30 Tubeless Rim Type: Hookless/Straight-Sidewall Inner-Tube Compatible: Yes, Only with Tubeless/Tubeless Ready Tyre, Inner Rim Width Dimension:M525 = 25mmAM30, M630, M730, M930 = 30mmM635, M735, M735 E = 35mmM640 = 40mmM685 = 85mmTyre Size Range Suggestions:M525 = 2.12.4AM30, M630, M730, M930 = 2.32.6M635, M735, M735 E = 2.52.8M640 = 2.83.2M685 = 3.84.5. We wont always be the first to market, but when we offer something, you can be sure its been thoroughly tested. "The tire has been run and raced on both steel, aluminum, and carbon fiber wheelsets, including our own, throughout the world with no previously reported consistent failures," the company said. There is no question that the ride quality of the Compass/Rene Herse extralight tires is fantastic. Thanks! As mentioned earlier, Enves rims and our tires keep evolving, even if its not always apparent to the customer. Ive often wondered why some tire makers make their tires without any reinforcement there. And goatheads. Thanks for the endurance casing. It also said the Specialized S Works 2Bliss 28mm is not compatible with Enve's hookless rims, including Enve's G23 and SES 4.5 AR rims. We had a set of DT carbon rims on a Bicycle Quarterly test bike recently, and the tire fit seemed very good on both front and rear rims. Im also considerably heavier than 100 lbs. In short, hookless is chosen to deliver a more safe, reliable, and ultimately proper tire fitment. If any wear and/or damage is identified, replace before riding. Receive emails to keep up with the latest products and offers, SAVE UP TO 40% ON TRIATHLON, ROAD, HYBRID AND CRUISER BIKES, ENVE Foundation Road 45 Carbon Road Wheels, The ENVE 45 is a modern multi-purpose road wheel in every way. If not, I believe your report is inaccurate. Tubeless technology is maturing, and rim makers are realizing that the rim tolerances need to be closer than they were in the old days. In other words: top-quality hookless carbon rims are fine, but aluminum rims need hooks. Myths Debunked: Higher Tire Pressure is NOT Faster, Enve and Zipp hookless rims and Rene Herse tires. Ive recently installed a pair of 38mm Steilacooms, and those fit really well on the DT wheels. Do the Pacenti Brevet rims have hooks? Well always put rider safety first. Its hard to comment on a single case wed have to check that particular rim, that particular tire, the installation, etc. Over the last year, weve worked with the engineers from both companies to ensure the full compatibility of our tires with their rims. We never sell your personal information. Specifically is hookless the best design overall, or the best design for a carbon wheel. Two that come to mind are Velocity Atlas and SunRingle Rhyno Lite, both available in 36h for ISO 559 wheels (my preferred size). But unless something has really changed, I wouldnt ride these tubeless on ENVE G23 or other ENVE hookless rims. Riders with inclinations toward racing and hard solo efforts will find the rims drag-taming, and cross-wind defying shape a welcome upgrade to their rides. Like our SES wheel family, the Foundation Collection and its ENVE 45 were tested and developed at the Mercedes Benz Formula One wind-tunnel to deliver best-in-class real world aero performance. ANY ROAD, ANY TIMEThe ENVE 45 is a modern multi-purpose road wheel in every way. Velocity USA makes plenty of Clydesdale rims with 36, 40 or even 48 holes. In both instances, the tires were installed tubeless and seated perfectly fine, but they blew off the rear rim totally inadvertently while riding, one as far out as around 500 miles from initial installation. We recommend building up the rim bed with extra layers of tape, but there is only so much you can do before the rims sidewalls arent tall enough to hold the tire securely. Great article. Thanks for this clarifying post. Performance is Important for Slow Riders, too! Thanks for this clarifying post! Most aluminum rims have hooks. Seated really easy and fast, so it felt really reassuring. Ive been looking around for a couple of rims to replace the worn-out ones on my current wheels. ENVE wheelsets work with a wide variety of tyres but to ensure the best performance browse which tyres are compatible with which ENVE wheels. Enve and Zipp have shown that the best hookless rims can be safe with high-performance tires. That is why they offer more speed and comfort (and traction), but the tolerances of the rim/tire interface need to be tighter. Aerodynamics are an unalienable right for road cyclists and triathletes that allows for greater efficiency and confidence inspiring handling, regardless of wind conditions. remained almost unchanged, as the rim/tire interface was a known quantity. The rim maker only can control the radius, and small errors get magnified. Challenge's response could be summed up as "it's not our tires, it's their rim." In no instance was the pressure above the recommended upper limit of 60 psi. Glad you are on the improved rims now. Do not run cloth or plastic (including ENVE) non-tubeless compatible rim tape or strips. Coming form a mtbiking backgroundit is tubeless all the way. It should not have been necessary, however, if manufacturers respected international standards instead of forcing their preferences upon consumers. There are no limitations on tyre compatibility with these wheel models. Run the Best Pressure Tubeless means you can run the pressure you want to maximize comfort, traction, and rolling efficiency. Fortunately, our tires werent affected by the issue with Enves overly sharp rim edges. This tape should be installed regardless of whether you intend to run your wheels tubeless or not. All said, the ENVE 45 is everything that the dynamic modern road rider needs, and nothing thattheydont. That is one advantage of carbon: The rims come out of a mold, so they can be very consistent if they are manufactured with quality tooling and with care. Yet I was surprised that no other tire maker issued a warning or at least guidance. Id like to hear your thoughts on Eastons hookless carbon gravel rims regarding this matter. "Enve's SES have two sharp (<0.2mm) radii in their hooks, that leave two parallel cuts about 0.5mm apart, around the entire radius of our (and other company's) tires, at around 3-4mm above the bead," Challenge said. Models:SES 3.4 AR, SES 4.5 AR Tubeless Rim Type: Hookless/Straight-Sidewall Inner-Tube Compatible: Yes, Only with Tubeless/Tubeless Ready Tyre Inner Rim Width Dimension: 25mm Aero Optimised Tyre Size Recommendation: 27-28mm Tyre Size Range Compatibility: 27mm Rims Maximum Tyre Pressure: 80psi/5.5bar (28mm tyre), 67psi/4.6bar (32mm tyre), Continental GP5000 TL 28mm Hutchinson Sector 32 32mm Hutchinson Fusion 5 Performance 11Storm 28mm Hutchinson Fusion 5 All Season 11Storm 28mm Mavic Yksion Pro UST 28mm Pirelli Cinturato Velo TLR 28mm Pirelli Cinturato Velo TLR 32mm Specialized S-Works Turbo 2Bliss Ready 28mm Specialized Roubaix Pro 2Bliss Ready 30/32mm Teravail Rampart All-Road Light/Supple TR (Tan Sidewall) 32mm, Models:G23 (700c), G27 (650b) Tubeless Rim Type: Hookless/Straight-Sidewall Inner-Tube Compatible: Yes, Only with Tubeless/Tubeless Ready Tyre Inner Rim Width Dimension: G23=23mm, G27=27mm Tyre Size Range Compatibility: G23 28mm, G27 42mm Rims Maximum Tyre Pressure: G23 = 60psi/4.1bar (32mm tyre), G27 = 40psi/2.75bar (42mm tyre), Please note that the internal rim width of the G23 is 23mm and intended for use with tubeless ready tyres 28mm with 40mm tyres being the primary focus of the design. The ENVE 45 features ENVEs patent pending Wide Hookless Bead which is a design element at the leading edge of the rim that dissipates impact energy and reduces the likelihood of pinch flatting your tubed or tubeless tire. In a separate dialog I also pushed Enve to explain their use of hookless. White Industries now makes hookless aluminum . No minimum pressure recommendation exactly because it all depends on rider weight. Enve also confirmed that the diameter of our Rene Herse tires is very consistent, so there is little danger of getting a tire that fits poorly because its a bit on the large side. I have some Compass Steilacooms that Im hoping to mount on my Enve hookless rims (g23 or 3.4AR) do they pass the test as well? There are no limitations on tyre compatibility with these wheel models. Please refer to our Tire Compatibility page to see what tires are approved/recommended for use with the ENVE 45. I have never had an issue the Schwalbe G one speeds in either 35 or 38 mm versions, WTB byways in 40 and 44 versions, and WTB Resolutes in 42. In fact for the Barlow pass tires it was set at around 45 to 50 psi. Plastic rim strips and cloth tapes are too thick, bridge the drop-centre rim channel, and will make installation and removal of tyres extremely difficult.Cotton and/or Natural Fibre Sidewall Tyres ENVE does not recommend the use of cotton or natural fibre sidewall non-tubeless tyres with ENVE SES wheelsets for everyday use. Next to wheel choice, few decisions will impact your performance more than choosing the right tyre. I suspect the same is the case with Enves rims. Tires wear out faster than rims (and are much cheaper), so they get used up before theres a need for a trade-in program. A report that will give confidence to many. The company noted that it has sold millions of the Open Corsa tires since they were introduced in 1996. Tubeless is the future and the future is now. Inner tubes are a great choice for most rides. These are all relatively stiff tires that run at relatively low pressures. There is nothing wrong with using a compressor, but if you need repeated large blasts of air to seat the tire, then the rim is probably undersized. It was inflated within your recommended specs. Our supple high-performance tires dont have the same casing stiffness as the mtb-derived gravel tires you mention. Built upon over a decade of carbon wheel crafting experience, the Foundation 45 brings our knowledge and technology to the masses. Both factors combine to create much greater forces at the tire/rim interface than on other vehicles. The Enve engineers called it The Problem of Pi.. ENVE Worthy, and priced to provide the foundation for confident riding through performance crafted carbon in the US. I had a Barlow Pass blow off an Enve M50 rim several years back. Models: ENVE 45, ENVE 65 Tubeless Rim Type: Hookless/Straight-Sidewall Inner-Tube Compatible: Yes, Only with Tubeless/Tubeless Ready Tyre Inner Rim Width Dimension: 21mm Aero Optimised Tyre Size Recommendation: 25mm-26mm Tyre Size Range Compatibility: 25mm Maximum Rim Pressure: 90psi/6.2bar, Hutchinson Fusion 5 All Season Storm TR 25mm Specialized S-Works Turbo Gripton 26mm Continental GP5000 TL 25mm Continental GP5000 TL 28mm Hutchinson Sector 32 32mm Hutchinson Fusion 5 Performance 11Storm 28mm Hutchinson Fusion 5 All Season 11Storm 28mm Mavic Yksion Pro UST 28mm Pirelli Cinturato Velo TLR 24mm Pirelli Cinturato Velo TLR 26mm Pirelli Cinturato Velo TLR 28mm Pirelli Cinturato Velo TLR 32mm Specialized S-Works Turbo 2Bliss Ready 28mm Specialized Roubaix Pro 2Bliss Ready 30/32mm Teravail Rampart All-Road Light/Supple TR (Tan Sidewall) 32mm, Models:SES 2.2, SES 3.4, SES 5.6, SES 7.8, SES Disc Wheel Tubeless Rim Type: Hooked-Bead Inner-Tube Compatible: Yes Inner Rim Width Dimension: 18-20.5mm Aero Optimised Tyre Size Recommendation: 25mm Tyre Size Range Compatibility: 23mm to 32mm Rims Maximum Tyre Pressure: 120psi. Click here for step-by-step instructions how to set up supple high-performance tires tubeless. Blended aero properties, tubeless compatibility, and pinch flat protection for the rider looking to test the waters on carbon wheel performance. I no longer have these wheels as I used Enves trade in to get a second set of M525 (no objective data but subjectively I like the tire profile and handling of the wider internal width of the M525 over the M50). Feeling a little under-served by the cycling industry again. This testing, while more time consuming and expensive, ensures that the ENVE 45 delivers performance advantages to riders of all abilities. The benefits of road tubeless are as follows: Lower rolling resistance By eliminating the inner-tube, the friction between tire and tube is also eliminated, allowing the tire roll, flex, and conform to the road with greater efficiency. The ENVE 45 is optimized for use with tubeless tires greater than 25mm wide. The ENVE 45 is a modern multi-purpose road wheel in every way. Materials, dimensions and other parameters are constantly fine-tuned, even with the same mold. This testing, while more time consuming and expensive, ensures that the ENVE 45 delivers performance advantages to riders of all abilities. I did offer to bring my Barlow Passes and M50s over to you when I was having the burping problems and again after the blow off (Im local to you). Fortunately I was not riding at the time. With more than a decades experience in developing some of the worlds fastest wheels, we are uniquely qualified to deliver best-in-class aerodynamics to the Foundation customer. These tyres are intended for high-performance racing applications only. Because carbon fiber gets its strength from continuous fibers, ENVE routes the fibers around the hole without cutting them, increasing the strength of each spoke hole. Its great that you have worked with the two leading wheel manufacturers in the north american market to ensure that your tyres are safe to use with their products. Those with inclinations towards the road lost and forgotten will find the rims width and anti-pinch flat technology complementary to higher volume tubeless road tires., ** total_quantity ** | ** unit_price ** / ** unit_measure **, Lifetime Incident Protection and 5 Year Factory Warranty, (Visit our tire pressure page to dial in your best tire pressure), Tire Compatibility: Tubeless 25c or larger, Real World Foundation Aero Technology, Wide Hookless Bead provides pot-hole protection, Tubeless Optimized for Rolling Fast and Fewer Flats. Id like to test (and measure) a few more wheels before saying anything definitive, but it seems fine. This technique pays large dividends in the final product by allowing for a lighter spoke face while improving rim strength. Enve told dealers and registered purchasers of its carbon wheels to avoid certain tires from Vittoria and Challenge. Those with inclinations towards the road lost and forgotten will find the rims width and anti-pinch flat technology complementary to higher volume tubeless road tires.All said, the ENVE 45 is everything that the dynamic modern road rider needs, and nothing that they dont. ENVE chooses a hookless tubeless rim profile as it allows the rims critical tolerance at the bead seat diameter to be both consistent and accurate. We also believe that to the extent such issues exist, they often pose similar risks regardless of the brand of performance tire used," the company said. Enve's Jake Pantone told BRAIN on Friday that he couldn't comment on the situation. Please note that the internal rim width of the G23 is 23mm and intended for use with tubeless ready tyres 28mm with 40mm tyres being the primary focus of the design. Built upon over a decade of carbon wheel crafting experience, the Foundation 45 brings our knowledge and technology to the masses. When in doubt, you can always run your tires with tubes. Very informative. Because of this process, our spoke holes are capable of maintaining higher spoke tensions, greatly reducing the risk of spoke pull-through and the need to constantly true your wheels.
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